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Post by rabid on Sept 16, 2016 19:43:22 GMT -7
Looks like with a little bit more molding you could have an Anton class. (Why anyone would want to recreate that pig, idon't know. Let's add 8 nacelles and call it a Super Kamekameha class dreadnought.).
The minis are all about 1/2500 scale aren't they? Has anyone tried the resin kits from the starship modeler store?
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Post by trynda1701 on Sept 16, 2016 20:05:21 GMT -7
All my minis here are essentially 1/3900 scale (FASA) or 1/3788 (SFB minis from ADB), with other manufacturers minis rescaled to match (Aerotech/Silent Death fighters or Micromachines shuttles)!
But I have seen pics of folks playing games with modded Trek kits based on the AMT Movie Enterprise and K'tinga kits on five foot poles at a convention many years ago!
Compared to that, 1/2500 scale is a little more manageable if you're prepared to kitbash to make FASA designs!
Mark
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Post by rabid on Sept 16, 2016 20:07:14 GMT -7
But I have seen pics of folks playing games with modded Trek kits based on the AMT Movie Enterprise and K'tinga kits on five foot poles at a convention many years ago! That sounds cool as hell!
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Post by trynda1701 on Sept 16, 2016 20:14:53 GMT -7
Yes, it does, doesn't it? Would have loved to have seen the game in person. Although I don't think it was the FASA rules, I think they ran it similar to the Command and Control rules with either two or three players per ship.
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Post by trynda1701 on Sept 17, 2016 12:01:37 GMT -7
Just for peoples information, based on what rabid and I were talking about last night, here is a scale comparison picture I found on the web showing a few different Enterprise minis... Image credit: www.viewfromtheturret.comFrom left to right, we have the Star Trek Attack Wing Constitution class, which as we can see is WAY too small, a Starfleetgames Starline SL2400 Constitution in 1/3788 scale, a Starline SL2500 Constitution in 1/3125 scale, an AMT Constitution in 1/2500 scale, and an AMT Constitution refit, also in 1/2500 scale. Here's a link to the blog post where I found the above picture... viewfromtheturret.com/2013/08/26/star-trek-enterprise-size-comparison/So if you wanted, you could game with 1/2500 scale minis, if you were willing to find garage kits for various fan created ships from the Technical books that have been created over the years (eg Surya class, Belknap class, or the various Franz Joseph designs from the original "Technical Manual" etc), but like I said you would have to kit bash yourself to create a lot of the FASA designs. Although there might be a few FASA designs in existence in this scale already. Mark
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Post by trynda1701 on Sept 18, 2016 13:11:21 GMT -7
Ok, now it's onto what I believe might be Swedes' favourite race, unfortunately left behind by FASA (hence all the House Rules for them!), the Tholians! I believe it was swede who said there was actually one lone Tholian ship in the First Edition of the game, I can't remember if you've posted the stats for that ship on the forum, swede? Anyway, first up, the mini representing the ships we see in "The Tholian Web" episode. ADB SL2200 Tholian Patrol Corvette Class starshipThese are nice little minis, showing more detail than was originally visible in the TV episode, and I like these more than what is now shown on the Remastered episode VFX, which look like the ships shown in the "Star Trek: Enterprise" episodes. They are small, as shown below... ADB SL2200 Tholian Patrol Corvette Class starship and SL2200 Constitution Class...but that is what was shown in the original episode, and I feel these minis reflect that nicely. Below are a few more comparisons with some of my minis you have seen already on this thread.... ADB SL2200 Tholian Patrol Corvette Class starship and Citadel (FASA) D-7 K'tinga ClassCitadel (FASA) D-7 K'tinga Class, ADB SL2200 Tholian Patrol Corvette Class starship, and SL2200 Constitution ClassAnd here is my attempt to simulate a scene from the actual episode, minus the VFX of course... Two Tholian PCs and a Federation Starship!!!Now, this mini is still available in the SL2400 range from ADB, as shown here... www.starfleetstore.com/tholian-c-12_30/tholian-pc-p-204.html...probably looking a little bit softer in detail as they are now made from pewter, and the SL2200 was made of lead. However, there are two other PC minis that you may sometimes come across. First of all... SL2200 Tholian PC and Gamescience Tholian T-Type StarshipThis is the Tholian mini that was used with Lou Zocchis' Star Fleet Battlle Manual, first published in 1977, just ahead of Star Fleet Battles, and recently reprinted in a new Third Edition in 2014... www.rpgnow.com/product/133010/Star-Fleet-Battle-Manual-3rd-Edition The mini itself is a tiny bit larger than the SL2200 mini, but is simpler in design. Yet it captures the classic Tholian 'tribladed' hull design perfectly, in fact it is probably exactly the detail the original fiilming miniature had! Here it is in comparison to the SL2200 Constitution mini... Gamescience Tholian T-Type and SL2200 Constitution ClassThe other PC mini you might come across is shown below... SL2200 Tholian Patrol Corvette and SL2300 Tholian Patrol Corvette miniThis mini is part of a short range of minis that ADB released, and it's a bit different from the SL2200/SL2400 sculpt. It's more detailed, but I think a bit more crudely sculpted. But it does give you another small Tholian mini to use in your fleet if you so desire. Here's a group shot of all three Tholian PC minis together... Three Tholian PC minis...with the SL2200 and Gamescience T-Type in front of the SL2300 mini. Mark
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Post by kaisernathan1701 on Sept 18, 2016 14:24:27 GMT -7
Cool minis
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Post by trynda1701 on Sept 18, 2016 16:21:33 GMT -7
Ok, so on to other SFB minis for Tholians. Here are a couple of other minis that I have in my collection... ADB SL2200 Tholian Patrol Corvette Class and Tholian CA starshipIn SFB history, the Tholians are refugees from another galaxy (M81) following an uprising by former subjects of their Empire (called Seltorans), and arrived in our galaxy in a Dyson Sphere, which has only one basic shipyard, capable of building only PC type hulls. They learn to build large ships to defend their territory and Dyson Sphere by welding these PC hulls together, as shown in this CA design, which uses two PC hulls. Here it is in comparison with a Constitution mini... ADB SL2200 Tholian CA Class and SL2200 Constitution Class starshipsMoving on from the CA type hull, we get the Tholians welding three PC hull types together... ADB SL2200 Tholian Patrol Corvette Class and Tholian DN Class starship...giving the Tholians a Dreadnought hull! Again, a nice extrapolation of the original Tholian design, and a nice mini to boot. Again, here is a DN in comparison with a Constitution class... ADB SL2200 Tholian DN Class and SL2200 Constitution Class starshipAfter decades in their new location, the Tholian fleet gets a much needed boost, when the 312th Battle Squadron arrives in our galaxy and finds the Dyson Sphere. This design style represents what the Tholians fielded back in the M81 galaxy, but were originally called 'Neo-Tholians' by the Federation, who thought the Dyson Sphere had begun to design upgraded new hulls... ADB SL2200 Tholian Patrol Corvette Class and SL2200 Neo-Tholian CA (NCA) Class starshipsAgain, a comparison shot... ADB SL2200 Neo-Tholian CA (NCA) and SL2200 Constitution starshipsAnd a slightly larger and heavier Neo-Tholian dreadnought design to go with the NCA design... ADB SL2200 Tholian Patrol Corvette Class and SL2200 Neo-Tholian DN (NDN) Class starshipsA comparison shot again with the Constitution class... ADB SL2200 Neo-Tholian DN (NDN) Dreadnought and SL2200 Constitution starshipsThat completes what SFB Tholian starships that I currently own. There are a few more designs available from ADB in the current SL2400 range, expanding the original Tholian and Neo-Tholian styles, which can be found on the ADB website here (with pictures)... www.starfleetstore.com/tholian-c-12_30/How you use these minis is up to you. When I tried to bring them into FASA, I was following the SFB ideas, and I have designs for some of the original style ships, but no Neo-Tholians. I know swede went in another direction, while using both styles. Mark
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Post by trynda1701 on Sept 18, 2016 17:11:49 GMT -7
As the Tholians have such a distinctive style, it might be hard to come up with some substitutes, so it's good that we still have minis available. But here are a couple of pics showing minis I used when the SL2200 minis were out of production in the 90s, but before the SL2400 range became commonly available. ADB SL2200 Tholian Patrol Corvette Class and FASA 'Renegade Legion: Interceptor' TOG Spiculum Class Medium FighterFrom another FASA game (ironic, huh?), here's something you could use as a Tholian vessel. Yes, it's low and flat, but at least it has two pointed hulls, eh? I suppose one could add some vertical fins to give it more of a Tholian look, but there you have it. Here's a comparison shot with a Constitution class again... FASA 'Renegade Legion: Interceptor' TOG Spiculum Class Medium Fighter and ADB SL2200 Constitution ClassMark
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Post by kaisernathan1701 on Sept 19, 2016 11:18:10 GMT -7
Cool stuff
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2016 18:26:55 GMT -7
Actually... yeah... that is really cool stuff.
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Post by thescreamingswede on Sept 21, 2016 22:04:11 GMT -7
Yup, that was me. In the very first edition of the ship combat system they provided ship sheets, already filled out, for the ships available at the time. The Tholian Web Spinner was among those. I had posted a picture of the ship sheet on the forum before its reboot into the present day format but I don't remember if I re-posted it. I based some of my earliest work on the Tholians for FASA off of this sheet. These early sheets look nothing like the ship sheets found in later versions of the game, and the Tholians were dropped completely. The layout is... .totally alien and a little hard to follow if you don't know the early ship combat rules.
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Post by rabid on Sept 22, 2016 10:38:36 GMT -7
DUde, that is SO Coool!
It shouldn't be too hard to put that into the game. Just a few tweaks required. But it looks a little weak, I guess maybe because the ship is so small. Intersting how the ships beam weapon damage scales according to range.
anyway sorry don't want to derail the thread. We should untangle this web (see what I did there) a little more.
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Post by trynda1701 on Sept 22, 2016 15:13:43 GMT -7
Here's a link to swedes Tholian ships, rabidststcsolda.proboards.com/thread/153/theswedes-tholian-shipsThat's interesting to see the original Tholian, swede. There doesn't seem to be a power allocation system as such. The sheet layout is a little like what became the Command and Control sheets the STSTCS system used to tie into the RPG. I thought the stats might have been a little like the simpler version used in the Star Trek III edition of the game, where the ships had two sets of stats, the simpler being approximately one third of the full size stats. But it looks like the First Edition was definitely a different beast! And going by that Tholian 'projector' weapon, I can see where you got the idea for your plasma disruptor weapons! Mark
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Post by Gorn on Sept 23, 2016 19:38:16 GMT -7
I just jury-rigged some ships that seem to work; based off of Klingon Academy. They have 3-set mounted phasers that can be fired individually, or as a set bank. There are rules for web generation in my house rules, but I also used it as a holding weapon, also like in Klingon Academy.
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Post by thescreamingswede on Sept 25, 2016 15:13:35 GMT -7
I got this from Darkrazor a while ago. As far as I know it was an original sculpt for a Tholian vessel. I've never seen another like it.
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Post by kaisernathan1701 on Sept 30, 2016 8:14:48 GMT -7
Looks like what a TNG era ship for them might look like
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Post by rabid on May 29, 2017 5:21:43 GMT -7
I was scanning through the thread, have you put up anything from Star Trek: Attack Wing? Most of them seem to be recasts of micro-machines (very close to the same size).
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Post by trynda1701 on May 29, 2017 7:25:13 GMT -7
I was scanning through the thread, have you put up anything from Star Trek: Attack Wing? Most of them seem to be recasts of micro-machines (very close to the same size). I do actually have a few ST Attack Wing miniatures. Been a bit hectic in real life recently, but I'll try and post some pictures of them soon.
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Post by trynda1701 on Jun 3, 2017 12:27:10 GMT -7
OK, per rabid s' request, here are a few pics of Star Trek Heroclix/Attack Wing minis you could use in your FASA STSTCS Games. As far as I understand it, the Heroclix and Attack Wing minis are identical, it is the bases that are different for each game. 1) Citadel (FASA) Klingon D-7/K't'inga Battlecruiser and Heroclix/Attack Wing K't'inga Battlecruiser2) Micromachines Klingon D-7 Battlecruiser and Heroclix/Attack Wing K't'inga Battlecruiser3) Citadel (FASA) Klingon D-7/K't'inga Battlecruiser, Heroclix/Attack Wing K't'inga Battlecruiser and Micromachines Klingon D-7 BattlecruiserSo, here's the classic Klingon D-7 in comparison pics. The first one shows that the FASA mini is smooth enough in detail to be both the TOS D-7 and the K't'inga classes, but the Attack Wing minis' detail is prominent enough that it can only be the K't'inga class and above. Its bigger than the FASA mini, and just about the same length as the Micromachines D-7, as you can see in the second picture. I don't know if there is a Attack Wing D-7 mini, and whether it could be a reissue of the original Micromachines D-7. What I do know is that I have some of the newer "Star Wars - The Force Awakens" Micromachines, and they aren't the same casts. The scale is VERY close on the T65 X-Wings and Imperial TIE fighters, but the details are slightly different. Anyway, the Trek Attack Wing minis aren't made of the same slightly bendy plastic as the Trek Micromachines, it's more rigid but slightly more brittle, so take care storing any if you get hold of some. The third picture shows all three in comparison, the ends of the engine nacelles are in line for all three to try and best show the size differentials. In person, the FASA mini is noticebly smaller. But I still think that you could mix and match, especially if you have difficulty getting hold of FASA minis these days. Mark
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Post by trynda1701 on Jun 3, 2017 14:20:29 GMT -7
1) Citadel (FASA) L-42 Great Bird and Heroclix Klingon Bird of Prey2) Micromachines Klingon Bird of Prey and Heroclix Klingon Bird of Prey3) Citadel (FASA) L-42 Great Bird, Heroclix Klingon Bird of Prey and Micromachines Klingon Bird of PreyThree similar pictures showing the Klingon Bird of Prey minis. The FASA mini is slightly smaller than the Micromachines and Heroclix minis, which are VERY close in size. Like I said on page 2 of this thread, you might want to use a FASA mini as the D-32 cruiser, and an Heroclix, Attack Wing or Micromachines mini as the L-42 Frigate. The Heroclix mini is still on its' Clix base, on the K't'inga minis I bought on eBay, they had been removed (they were advertised as such). I don't know how easy they would be to remove, I'm not bothered, but you might want to play Heroclix/Attack Wing in the future, and therefore might want to leave them on their bases. The third picture is aligned so that the front of the command booms are in line for size differential purposes. I don't have any other TOS/TMP/TUC era Heroclix or Attack Wing minis at present. I think a lot of us might know that the Constitution Class Attack Wing mini is WAY too small, as shown in the picture below... Image credit: www.viewfromtheturret.com...it looks like it's scaled to the TNG Galaxy Class! As you can see by comparing it to the 1/3788 scale Starline SL2400 mini from "Star Fleet Battles" to the right of it, it's WAY too small! The other TMP/TUC Heroclix/Attack Wing minis might be similar in scale to FASA minis like the D-7 and Bird of Prey minis above, but I don't know that for sure. Although I had enough Micromachines minis to supplement my FASA collection, I was tempted by the K't'inga and Bird of Prey minis for a comparison a year or so ago. Any others from that era I haven't seen in person. From pictures I've seen online, I think the Reliant/Miranda, Constitution Refit and Excelsior classes might be a bit smaller than their Micromachines counterparts, but like I said I'm not sure. But they're bigger than the Attack Wing Constitution! If anyone has any Heroclix or Attack Wing TOS/Movie era minis they've purchased since I started this thread, I'd love to see some comparisons pictures with any FASA minis you have. Mark
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Post by trynda1701 on Jun 3, 2017 16:50:45 GMT -7
As far as I understand it, the Heroclix and Attack Wing minis are identical, it is the bases that are different for each game. With regards to the above, here's a copy of info from the Memory Alpha website, which explains the games that use the Wizkids minis... From Memory Alpha "Star Trek: Tactics" entry... Star Trek: Tactics premiered at retail in February 2012 and includes thirty-three ships from the Federation and Klingon factions.
The starter kit and booster pack ships utilize the "Clix" system of game play and are compatible with WizKids' long-running series of "HeroClix" games. In the starter game, two or more players command multi-generational fleets of starships while representing either the Federation Starfleet or the Klingon Defense Force.
Booster pack ships are sold in sealed "blind boxes" without printed information about which ship is inside, similar to the marketing model used by gashapon toy manufacturers in Japan. Unpainted versions of all of the ship molds from the first Tactics game were released earlier in the Star Trek: Fleet Captains game. Later installments of Tactics saw WizKids introduce a number of Star Trek starships that had never been produced as licensed miniatures before.
The company released the Star Trek: Attack Wing game in August 2013. [1] Apart from being mounted on different stands, many of its painted ships are very similar to those released in the Tactics line. Unlike Tactics, Attack Wing's Federation ships do not have names or registry numbers painted onto their hulls and can be used to depict a number of different starships. In 2016, mono-colored versions of some of these starship molds were used again for WizKids' Star Trek: Frontiers game. So that says that the Tactics (HeroClix based) and the Attack Wing minis are just re-based between the different games. Mark
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Post by rabid on Jun 4, 2017 7:26:36 GMT -7
Trynda, I think the X-wing miniatures (and at least the x-wings from micro machines in the new batch) are close to 270 scale. Next to my x-wing miniatures game I can hardly tell them apart, a good dark paint wash and some dremel filing and they work on the game board (tie fighters are just too dinky though). But thank you SO MUCH for posting the Attack wing minis! You've convinced me to pick up a few of them. Since we know the "Klolode" D-7a is a bit bigger and bulkier than the D7M successor, the size difference is excusable on the table. Also wanted to share this with you---arguments about the "Abramsverse" enterprise aside, if you look at the original constitution this ship seems to be in close to FASA scale (close enough for gov'ment work, as we say down here) and it has a saucer different enough for kitbashing. They are all over the place at like 99 cents at Vintage STock. www.thetrekcollective.com/2013/02/more-hot-wheels-star-trek.html
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Post by trynda1701 on Jun 4, 2017 7:45:13 GMT -7
rabidYeah, if you use the MM D-7 and HeroClix/Attack Wing K't'inga together, that slight bulk difference between the FASA A and M models works perfectly. Thanks for that heads up on the Hot Wheels nuEnterprise. Your point about kit-bashing reminded me that I saw someone who kit-bashed FASA scaled minis including Chandlery classes, and some of his saucers looks like nuEnterprise style. I'll try and find a link to his blog with the pics. Mark
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Post by trynda1701 on Jun 4, 2017 17:31:59 GMT -7
Ok, here's a couple more HeroClix minis you could use in your STSTCS games. Vulcan Surak/Suurok Class VSS Ni'Var and D'Kyr Class VSS D'KyrThese two classes were of course from the 2150s' series "Enterprise". But as they were supposed to be advanced compared to the NX Class, you could perhaps conjecture that like Starfleets' Miranda and Excelsior classes of the 2280s' that were still in use in the 2360s' onwards, these could perhaps be in use in the FASA TOS/TMP/TUC timeframe of 2260-2290s. So as there are stats for Vulcan ships on this site here... fasaststcs.com/index.php/thefleets/united-federation-of-planets/vulcans/...you could use them with the standard FASA ships or your own designs in an occasional game or two. I'm sure there are Construction tables somewhere online as well with Vulcan technology stats. The Surak/Suurok mini could represent two classes ( Surak and Sh'Ran), as there seems to be pics of two different sized ships of the same design shown here... Image credit: ex-astris-scientia.org ...although going by the sizes in that pic, the minis are a bit small, as the D'kyr is nearly the length of the Galaxy class (600m vs 641m)! Below, the two minis are shown in comparison to the Citadel Enterprise class mini. Vulcan Surak/Suurok Class VSS Ni'Var, Citadel (FASA) Enterprise Class Cruiser and D'Kyr Class VSS D'KyrThe D'Kyr is about the same length as the Citadel Enterprise mini, and the Surak about two thirds the length of it. Mark
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